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Offline Scrasamax

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Light Quest Discussion
« on: August 30, 2010, 11:42:54 AM »
In interest in generating more action in the forums and to pimp the Light quest, I'd like to kick off a quest discussion.

Ideas, lack of ideas, extrapolation and so forth.

I am bouncing around a few ideas, feel free to use and abuse:

Cleric of a Light God
A God or Goddess of Light
A magical torch or flashlight
Laser Tech
Light Elementals, Light beings
Sword of Light, Light Sword (been done, but needs a new angle, or excellent development)
30 glowing things (Blydden might already have this one
Light Stones
Dark-light


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Offline Strolen

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2010, 07:58:59 PM »
Light actuated Magic
Reflective weapon
Creatures that turn to stone in the night
Chemicals/potions that are enacted when exposed to light
Mirrors reflecting light over horizon

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Offline JPatterson

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2010, 08:38:26 PM »
I made my first submission here, on this light quest thing, kinda neat. I probably wouldn't normally have submitted things, but I guess the themed thing is kind of a neat idea, and Chaos was in the chatroom and mentioned it, or I still probably wouldn't have done it. I got a comment already so that's neat.

So this is just for basically anything light-related, items, ideas, people, quests, etc? I did an item, I presume you can submit multiple things. I've actually been researching, the past few weeks, adventure writing structure, but I don't know if I've got anything worked out that would allow me to create a light-based adventure type thing, I've only written a couple of adventures, but it would be a neat idea for a future submission or something.

I did discover realworld charts about lumens and Lux and brightness levels, I might submit those just because they're a neat resource, whether or not they qualify.
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Offline Scrasamax

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2010, 10:20:49 PM »
There is no limit to the number of submissions you can submit. The winner is chosen by a vote, so volume doesnt guartantee a win.

The charts, while dry, might be quite ( wait for it.... )


Illuminating


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Offline Chaosmark

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #4 on: September 02, 2010, 06:27:31 PM »
Yeah, boo. That was horrible.

And if done properly, submitting that information could prove useful. But dry charts normally aren't all that useful by themselves. turn them into something nifty and interesting, and THEN you've got something useful.
P(A|B) = P(B|A)*P(A)/P(B)

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Offline JPatterson

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #5 on: September 02, 2010, 07:36:40 PM »
I don't know what something that was intended to display an incremental comparison and such, would be, otherwise? I'm not clear on the structures here - I've looked at various "examples" but there are a lot and there are no "constants", just different kinds of things.
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Offline Strolen

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #6 on: September 02, 2010, 08:57:23 PM »
I will give you crazy XP if you can document that confusion and help us make the site easier to get into. We have sort of known there is a relatively high learning curve when it comes to getting into the site so a new perspective on what is confusing or downright useless would be INCREDIBLY valuable to us. Many have been so long and lived through the changes that we just don't know what do to with it to make easy!

No obligation of course, but if you come up with some thoughts on it we will give you a kingdom of your own...or a llama.  Most people choose the llama.

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Offline Strolen

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #7 on: September 02, 2010, 09:05:55 PM »
Offer is open to anybody with a "New User Perspective"!!

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Offline Pieh

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #8 on: September 03, 2010, 11:09:47 PM »
I've been trying to write something for the Light Quest, but it's just been too ... HOT! This icky sticky humid weather is killing my mind! I've tried a few times to write things... Bio-Luminescent Goblins... The Temple of The Golden Flame... Sefhala, the Sun-Eye... I can get a few lines of interesting prose written down then my brain turns to mush. Maybe this hurricane, Earl, will cool things off a bit. Here's hoping! Good luck, everyone!
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Offline JPatterson

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2010, 10:18:06 AM »
Well I was just saying that "turn them into something nifty and interesting" relating to a chart of light ranges for various light sources or examples; I'm not really sure how you would do that - either it's a torch or a campfire or a full moon or it isn't.  I don't have any idea what he means when he says that. Another user commented on my lantern submission, that he wished it was... what was it, he would have preferred if it had been more personal - I don't know what that means and didn't remember reading that in the FAQs anywhere, so that is confusing.

Maybe it isn't so much the site itself but the comments from the users and the terminology and the expectations or sometimes complex and intricately evolved "understood" way of doing things that they take for granted, that is simply too much all at once, in too many directions and intensities and levels and categories, for new people to be able to process in an easily digestible procedural, hierarchical manner in an A to B to C fashion.
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Offline Chaosmark

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2010, 02:11:50 PM »
Quote from: JPatterson
Well I was just saying that "turn them into something nifty and interesting" relating to a chart of light ranges for various light sources or examples; I'm not really sure how you would do that - either it's a torch or a campfire or a full moon or it isn't.  I don't have any idea what he means when he says that.
If I knew how to do that, I'd have been more specific. :P That's the thing with creativity: I can say that it'll get a higher rating if it's interesting, but we all recognize that a dry technical topic, especially charts, are hard to actually make interesting. Just about the only real idea I have is to add ways to incorporate it into an adventure or campaign somehow. Perhaps a system of light-magic based on the various tables?

What I'm really aiming for is to get you to avoid just posting a dry, technical article saying, "This is what a lumen is, and this is the table for various objects and their lumenosity." We could look that up easily enough, thanks to the internet. What we want is added value, and that's the hard part. If you can make the topic into something that can be worked into a campaign (or even just an adventure), it'll get a much better reception than a dry table ever would.

Quote
Another user commented on my lantern submission, that he wished it was... what was it, he would have preferred if it had been more personal - I don't know what that means and didn't remember reading that in the FAQs anywhere, so that is confusing.

No, that sort of thing isn't in the FAQs anywhere. I can understand what he likely meant though; the item had a great description, quite a few nifty interesting bits, but it didn't have any sort of backstory or explanations beyond how it works. For example, how did such a remarkably advanced device make it's way into a low-tech world? A wizard summoned it? A craftsman was given the blueprints by some supernatural entity, demonic or divine? It has always existed, as a permanent fixture within the fabric of reality itself? Likewise, what gives it the strange indestructible property? Such a thing is fine, but most people would find it odd in a random item; even a mild explanation of why would make the item less abstract and more 'real'-feeling. The word I use is 'verisimilitude'.

Does that help answer your questions, at least in part?
P(A|B) = P(B|A)*P(A)/P(B)

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Offline JPatterson

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #11 on: September 04, 2010, 03:41:19 PM »
I see, thank you for the clarification.

I find these are subjective opinions, which again I guess leads to some confusion.  I personally find that at least for myself, I could not look these things up "easily enough", and it took a great many number of hours, spanning a number of days, from a number of different searches, to arrive at the final light-related compilation draft I have, and also accessing not just the internet but also a number of other roleplaying games' light source information statistics to draw conclusions and cross-references. I find nothing about the chart easy or obvious, but I tend to have that problem with a lot of things and I guess that's why I get stuck on doing research on a lot of things, I don't know.

Regarding the lantern, while I appreciate verisimilitude, I suppose I'm of the view that for some things, especially intended to be mysterious, "less is more" - perhaps it's a cop-out, or a cheap literary device, but leaving the ultimate origin of a character or item an unknown, to me, allows it to be an authentic artifact of mystery, not even the true creator, the author, knows how "old" it is or where it came from - it has no particular origin - more than be mysterious for mystery's sake though, this allows a GM to tailor the item to their needs and campaign, however they need, since GM's will do that anyway - to back-write the entire history of the item in a world you don't even know the item is going to exist in, seems questionable, to me, and unnecessary, as far as its purpose, for a tool for a GM to use for NPC or players.
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Offline Chaosmark

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #12 on: September 04, 2010, 08:40:17 PM »
That's certainly fair enough. I've been forced to do so much research over the years that I suppose it might be easier for me to find things than others. Acquired skillset and whatnot.

I can also understand the desire for mystery, as well as the opportunities that ambiguity and unanswered questions provide. And of course, GMs can and almost are required to modify anything they pull from the Citadel to use in their campaigns, just so that it will fit the setting. I just find that the more plot hooks and ideas one presents (in essence, ways to use the submission), the easier it is to find a use for something. As something of a merger of the two outlooks, you might like the ambiguity that can be found in the various Tales of Adventure. Tales of the Road has the original blurb about what a Tale of Adventure is. I don't think anyone has done so, but one could definitely apply the same concept of multiple-endings to the other types of submissions. Alternate origins for items, different histories or backstories for a location, that sort of thing.

I certainly don't want to come across as anti-ambiguity, just throwing out various things that might mesh well and give you more ideas.
P(A|B) = P(B|A)*P(A)/P(B)

By the power of Bayes!

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Current guild quest: --

Offline Scrasamax

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #13 on: September 05, 2010, 09:03:40 AM »
This is a fantastic discussion, gentlemen


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Offline JPatterson

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2010, 03:07:33 PM »
There are still a few things I want to fiddle with here and there on my submission on that item.

So I'm not sure about all the other submission types. Light-related/based people? I can kinda see that. Quests themselves? I guess I can kinda see those maybe. And all the other types or components available for submissions - and then whatever gets the highest votes wins the "quest"? That's pretty neat.
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Offline Pieh

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #15 on: September 15, 2010, 09:49:05 PM »
This is a very productive quest, and the vast majority of the material is very nice. I'm very happy with the turnout. Good work, everyone. Keep posting!
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Offline Strolen

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #16 on: September 16, 2010, 08:20:05 PM »
:)

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Offline Dossta

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #17 on: September 17, 2010, 11:36:43 PM »
Speaking as a newbie, quests are a good way of becoming introduced to the Citadel.  The subject matter for your first submissions is well-defined and you get decent XP right off the bat.  Also, it seems that quest subs receive heightened attention (please correct me if I'm wrong) so there's the potential for receiving a lot of quick feedback.

If there wasn't an active quest, I can imagine that it would be much harder to get into the Citadel.  You were asking for feedback earlier, Strolen, so here are my 2c:

1.  I can't for the life of me find the FAQ page -- not in the forum, or anywhere on the main site.  I've tried searching for it, and have browsed through all the menus, but have found nothing.  The most informative stuff I have found was your "How To" articles within the forum.  If there is a compiled FAQ page it should be a menu item on the main site, or at least a link in the header or footer.

2. I wish that I could view all of the Golden submissions on one page.  Same with HoH subs.  I know that I can bring up a list of all the Items then order them so that Golden subs, HoHs appear at the top of the list, but this seems like a bit of a hack.

I'll probably think of more as I delve deeper into the Citadel, but after a few weeks of posting I finally feel like I'm "getting" it a little bit.

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Offline Ancient Gamer

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #18 on: September 18, 2010, 03:51:58 AM »
Now that is what I call good and proper feedback!
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Offline Michael Jotne Slayer

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #19 on: September 18, 2010, 07:16:30 PM »
I concur with AG.
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Offline Strolen

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Re: Light Quest Discussion
« Reply #20 on: September 20, 2010, 08:17:08 PM »
I guess we need a FAQ! Excellent feedback, thanks!

Not been online too much lately but will be back with some actual thoughts!

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