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What should our third quest be?

Transports
3 (23.1%)
Unique Lifeforms
4 (30.8%)
Fortifications
2 (15.4%)
Artistic or Performance Societies
1 (7.7%)
The Sky
3 (23.1%)

Total Members Voted: 12

Voting closed: August 31, 2006, 04:41:08 AM

Author Topic: The Son of Quest  (Read 5276 times)

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Offline Ancient Gamer

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #25 on: August 29, 2006, 04:09:19 AM »
The current system seems to have, in my honest opinion, some deficits.
1. The time between each quest is too short. Right now a quest is a chore and not a joy. When they hit you like machine gun fire, you know they occur too frequently. Perhaps that is fine with some, but to me it is unneccessary noise that makes them more a nuisance than a bonus. I fear the users will ignore quests should this continue. This pertains in particular to the mature part of our crowd.
2. The quest planning could also need some more time. To create compelling quests, I believe it is prudent that we plan well and long, to truly come up with something exciting and genuine. The present two week deadline in which only neglected subjects and old, recycled ideas are accepted seem poor to me. Personally I have a career, but I would still like to have a say in the quest planning. Currently that would be difficult, as the timeline per se fits students and unemployed, and not those of us with demanding jobs.
3. There is still not any general agreement concerning the finalists. I consider the 4.5 limit preposterous and the arguments, though articulate and sincere, have not persuaded me of anything. I truly believe that a hall of honour says more than a high vote. A high vote is an indication of quality, but not bullet proof evidence of superiority. You all know that posts are evaluated differently, and one 4.6 might easily be poorer than a 4.3. An indication of this would be the 4.6 had no HoH's, while the 4.3 might be flooded with HoH's. Therefore I say that to neglect goldens and halls of honour is a great injustice and insult to that submission. High votes are too closely tied to herd voting, tactical voting and the audience in general to be the lone determining factor of quality.
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Offline CaptainPenguin

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #26 on: August 29, 2006, 05:54:49 PM »
Work it out amongst yourselves, I JUST WANT THE d**n QUEST TO START.
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Offline MoonHunter

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #27 on: August 30, 2006, 11:38:36 AM »
Besides, if it isnt picked, it will keep showing up on each quest challenge until it is selected. So I voted for it.

Actually, it'll only show up as long as someone keeps asking for it.

And you think I am going to stop?  It has a great deal of potential, this subject does.
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Offline MoonHunter

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #28 on: August 30, 2006, 11:57:43 AM »
This actually should of been in the votes

The current system seems to have, in my honest opinion, some deficits.
1. The time between each quest is too short.

Actually I prefere the quick turn around time.  It is a contest. It is supposed to stretch the normal limits.

Also, if we have a quicker turn around we have the momentum from the previous quest to keep us going. The lag between the previous quest and the then next quest to be the reason there was so little interest.

2. The quest planning could also need some more time. To create compelling quests, I believe it is prudent that we plan well and long, to truly come up with something exciting and genuine. The present two week deadline in which only neglected subjects and old, recycled ideas are accepted seem poor to me. Personally I have a career, but I would still like to have a say in the quest planning. Currently that would be difficult, as the timeline per se fits students and unemployed, and not those of us with demanding jobs.

I have a demanding job and I can join the quest. And we have been planning this next once since the first one started.  It is a contest. Can you not squeeze a post in a two week span?

3. There is still not any general agreement concerning the finalists. I consider the 4.5 limit preposterous and the arguments, though articulate and sincere, have not persuaded me of anything. I truly believe that a hall of honour says more than a high vote. A high vote is an indication of quality, but not bullet proof evidence of superiority. You all know that posts are evaluated differently, and one 4.6 might easily be poorer than a 4.3. An indication of this would be the 4.6 had no HoH's, while the 4.3 might be flooded with HoH's. Therefore I say that to neglect goldens and halls of honour is a great injustice and insult to that submission. High votes are too closely tied to herd voting, tactical voting and the audience in general to be the lone determining factor of quality.

Again, there has been no compelling argument to eliminate the existing system either.  It is a contest, not an enshrinement. Plus all the other systems we have so far provided have been either more complicated OR allow for the friendship networks to skew the results. No system is perfect. .

Quests were originally created with the idea to generate a number of posts in a given category or type. By basing it on our normal criterias, votes and such, we get a more "standardized" and "fair" result.  Besides HoH votes are cheap and easy to do. 

Someone of 3rd level or higher is bored, and something gets HoH votes. HoH as we are currently using is not indicator we originally hoped it would be. (And this is a discussion for another thread.) Thus not that great of an indicator of quality, just of popularity OR the lack of submission on a given day. Besides anything hit with an HoH will get more votes, with an unusual disposition towards higher votes.
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Offline Ancient Gamer

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #29 on: August 30, 2006, 01:30:36 PM »
This actually should of been in the votes
Let us do it here.

The current system seems to have, in my honest opinion, some deficits.
1. The time between each quest is too short.

Actually I prefere the quick turn around time.  It is a contest. It is supposed to stretch the normal limits.

Also, if we have a quicker turn around we have the momentum from the previous quest to keep us going. The lag between the previous quest and the then next quest to be the reason there was so little interest.
Well, I'd definitely drop off the quest race. As I said: It is perfect for people with less than demanding jobs and students. For people with an active social life, children and family in addition to the job it is difficult.

Make no mistake: I am lobbying for myself and people in my situation here. Yes, like Shadoweagle said (in the admin forum): We might not be as relevant in the current day situation, as we are more or less inactive relics of the past.

2. The quest planning could also need some more time. To create compelling quests, I believe it is prudent that we plan well and long, to truly come up with something exciting and genuine. The present two week deadline in which only neglected subjects and old, recycled ideas are accepted seem poor to me. Personally I have a career, but I would still like to have a say in the quest planning. Currently that would be difficult, as the timeline per se fits students and unemployed, and not those of us with demanding jobs.

I have a demanding job and I can join the quest. And we have been planning this next once since the first one started.  It is a contest. Can you not squeeze a post in a two week span?
It is difficult. Sometimes I can, but that also means I must get up to date on all the previous posts and opinions around this place, AND I have to respond to the onslaught of replies that are bound to come (we are a verbose lot here at the citadel). So, my answer given the circumstances I just stated is more likely to be no.

3. There is still not any general agreement concerning the finalists. I consider the 4.5 limit preposterous and the arguments, though articulate and sincere, have not persuaded me of anything. I truly believe that a hall of honour says more than a high vote. A high vote is an indication of quality, but not bullet proof evidence of superiority. You all know that posts are evaluated differently, and one 4.6 might easily be poorer than a 4.3. An indication of this would be the 4.6 had no HoH's, while the 4.3 might be flooded with HoH's. Therefore I say that to neglect goldens and halls of honour is a great injustice and insult to that submission. High votes are too closely tied to herd voting, tactical voting and the audience in general to be the lone determining factor of quality.

Again, there has been no compelling argument to eliminate the existing system either.  It is a contest, not an enshrinement. Plus all the other systems we have so far provided have been either more complicated OR allow for the friendship networks to skew the results. No system is perfect. .

There is no compelling reason to keep the current one either. All I say is that we take Hall of Honours into regard in some way or another. Shadoweagle came up with a really good model if you ask me (2 Hall of Honours minimum AND minimum 4.5 average score). We might also want to require a minimum number of votes for the entry to be accepted (perhaps even not nominate any finalists until all quest entries had the required number of votes).

Quests were originally created with the idea to generate a number of posts in a given category or type. By basing it on our normal criterias, votes and such, we get a more "standardized" and "fair" result.  Besides HoH votes are cheap and easy to do. 

Someone of 3rd level or higher is bored, and something gets HoH votes. HoH as we are currently using is not indicator we originally hoped it would be. (And this is a discussion for another thread.) Thus not that great of an indicator of quality, just of popularity OR the lack of submission on a given day. Besides anything hit with an HoH will get more votes, with an unusual disposition towards higher votes.
And what makes high votes any different from this? As I have said earlier I can find hundreds of inflated submissions with scores above and beyond reason.
Hall of Honour is inflated, votes are inflated and both these inflated mechanisms should count!

As should goldens.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2006, 01:46:11 PM by Ancient Gamer »
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Offline MoonHunter

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #30 on: August 30, 2006, 05:00:01 PM »
You know... We should change the rules AND make AG the moderator of the Quest.

All in favor?
« Last Edit: August 30, 2006, 05:06:36 PM by MoonHunter »
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Offline CaptainPenguin

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #31 on: August 30, 2006, 05:10:45 PM »
As much as that is a good idea, shouldn't we ask for Ria's input on that particular change of moderationship? (that's not a real word, but you get the idea)
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Offline MoonHunter

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #32 on: August 30, 2006, 05:19:57 PM »
I am good for that.
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Offline Ria Hawk

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #33 on: August 30, 2006, 05:30:36 PM »
He can have it if he wants it, but I don't mind doing it.
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Offline Strolen

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #34 on: August 31, 2006, 06:10:07 AM »
Unless Ria absolutely doesn't want to do it, she's my girl and her decision will have my weight.

(will chime in tonight - will explain my silence too)

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Offline CaptainPenguin

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #35 on: August 31, 2006, 07:29:28 PM »
So sayeth the Lord, our Lord
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Offline Ria Hawk

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Re: The Son of Quest
« Reply #36 on: September 01, 2006, 04:31:30 AM »
The Citadel has spoken.  I'm sure all of us can find a Unique Lifeform to submit.
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