llamaenterhear
Username: Password:

Author Topic: DRAGONIZE! The Secret of True Half-Dragon Power!  (Read 5628 times)

0 Members and 1 Lonely Barbarian are spying on this topic.

Offline CaptainPenguin

  • Bastardo!
  • Squirrel Strolenati
  • Emperor
  • *
  • Posts: 5869
  • Awards Questor Hall of Heroes 10
    • Awards
DRAGONIZE! The Secret of True Half-Dragon Power!
« on: March 27, 2003, 09:03:49 PM »
Dragons were always my favorite creature. Conversely, I've always wanted to play Half-Dragon, but I am often stuck being the GM (Don't get me wrong, I love to GM) and my friends won't let me play a Half-Dragon. Over the years, my own opinions on dragons and the magnificent Breath of Fire videogame series has shaped my dragons and half-dragons and I've come up with this:

Dragonizing.

The secret power of half-dragons that allows them to become even more dragon-like, taking on a dragon spirit to boost their stats and make them super-powerful.
For instance, Kazun the Half-Red Dragon is battling a bound demon. After being struck a near-mortal blow, Kazun becomes angry and loses control. He Dragonizes! His eyes glow like flames, his hands become scaly claws that burn, his body become clad in shimmery red dragonmail. He leaps across the battlefield on a trail of flame, unleashing a blast of superheated energy from his mouth onto the bound demon, incinerating it.

Of course, if Kazun were to stay in Red Dragonized Form too long, he would lose control forever, and go rampaging across the world until some Dragon Slayer stopped him.

So, what do you think?
Currently Reading: "Kafka On The Shore" by Haruki Murakami

Currently Listening To: "Piece Of Time" by Atheist

Offline Agar

  • Master
  • ***
  • Posts: 472
  • Awards Item Guild Golden Creator Hall of Heroes 10 Plot Guild
    • Awards
DRAGONIZE! The Secret of True Half-Dragon Power!
« Reply #1 on: March 27, 2003, 10:57:07 PM »
Sound like a great start to a saturday morning cartoon.

Dragons are great, and I mean they truely kick @$$, but getting that power to a level that makes it a fair and playable character is one of the hardest problems to solve.

Dragonizing sounds like a possible way to get there, but a more objective look at it might help. I'll start with a quick break down of the pros and cons of a dragonizing player character, feel free to add details you'd forgotten or want to add.

Pros
    Boosts stats - of course
    Super Powerful - a bit much perhaps?
    Scaly claws - dagger sharp at the least
    Dragon mail - how low and AC or AC boost?
    Trail of fire - normal or magical?
    Blast of superheated energy from the mouth - listerine strips? :lol:

Cons
    Only happens when you lose control - Meaning the player decides when or is forcibly made to lose control because the DM says so.

    Loss of control can be permanent - Meaning it's no longer your character and therefore no real loss.


All in all, this is a lot of power, all available at your whim, with out much of a price tag. Not a balance most GMs like. For PCs at least  :twisted: So, to make the idea more permissible to GMs, some balancing needs to be done.

For example, the Super powerful just rings of He-man style feats, perhaps you could just settle for the stat boost? Trails of fire can be quite hazardous, especially when you're in a loss-of-control breserking situation. Dragon breath . . . ok that's just too cool to give up, but what about making it a double edged sword? You take a couple points of damage every time you use it, but only to your mouth. It takes one day to regain normal use of your mouth, like tasting or yawning with out cracking, bleeding flesh, and each use before you heal doubles the healing time. That could work the same for acid and lightning breath, but poison clouds, maybe they could just linger, making it dangerous to get close to people and plain smell bad to boot.

Also some more restrictions might be in order, like an aura of power while breserk. Everyone with in range takes noticable damage, even friends, meaning you get isolated as they avoid you and you could become trapped and alone, and you are hurting your allies. There's always the social stigma, meaning the general populace sees people like you as a mix of demon, leper, and madman. Throw in some vertigal physical characteristics like scaly palms, forked tounge, thick fingernails and/or slitted eyes and you'll have a big adventure trying not to have the ignorant populace burn you. Having normal (non-magical) animals be afraid of you always sucks too.

By placing yourself in the minority, being wrongly accused and having to constantly hide it, and likely hurting anyone you get close to, you won't be a popular guy. The more of an underdog you make yourself, the more a GM will favor letting you try out your idea.

I have always like dragons (see my dragon-lord post) and half dragons too, If there was a fair way to let them play at the same level as the PCs, I would play one instantly.
After a brief retirement while I got married and traveled the country, I'm back. Just getting back into the swing of things for now, but gearing up to hit things up like I used to.

Offline CaptainPenguin

  • Bastardo!
  • Squirrel Strolenati
  • Emperor
  • *
  • Posts: 5869
  • Awards Questor Hall of Heroes 10
    • Awards
DRAGONIZE! The Secret of True Half-Dragon Power!
« Reply #2 on: March 27, 2003, 11:22:43 PM »
Yes, of course.

Sometimes, I get a little bit.....munchkin.......

(Slaps himself across the face and dunks himself in cold water)

I think I'm OK now.

The leaping with the trails of fire is purely cinematic.
Currently Reading: "Kafka On The Shore" by Haruki Murakami

Currently Listening To: "Piece Of Time" by Atheist

Offline CaptainPenguin

  • Bastardo!
  • Squirrel Strolenati
  • Emperor
  • *
  • Posts: 5869
  • Awards Questor Hall of Heroes 10
    • Awards
DRAGONIZE! The Secret of True Half-Dragon Power!
« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2003, 11:27:06 PM »
Hmmm....Stat boost; yes. Super-powerful; too munchkin.
Damage from breath weapons; that's very good!
Aura of power (berzerk); that's also a good one.
Don't most half-dragons exhibit cosmetic dragon-like features?

The GM should be given control of the "whens" of dragonizing, so that PCs don't abuse the power, even with the (albeit small) limits put on it.
Currently Reading: "Kafka On The Shore" by Haruki Murakami

Currently Listening To: "Piece Of Time" by Atheist

Offline Pirate Penguin

  • Da Penguin Commissar
  • Guardian
  • **
  • Posts: 202
    • Awards
interesting
« Reply #4 on: April 02, 2003, 05:40:04 PM »
Well my flightless friend you might try what i do with the race Half-Demon, and half angel. Yuo could add a permanat stat improval like if you are a Half red dragon your atack is raised, but you can't stand water or people might not want to talk to you!  :purpdragon:  :purdragon:  :bigdragon:  :reddevil:  :flydrag1:  :chimera2:  :babyd:  :dracoliche:
You may know me from... nevermind just go away

Offline Agar

  • Master
  • ***
  • Posts: 472
  • Awards Item Guild Golden Creator Hall of Heroes 10 Plot Guild
    • Awards
DRAGONIZE! The Secret of True Half-Dragon Power!
« Reply #5 on: April 03, 2003, 05:49:05 PM »
Wasn't that idea turned into a really bad movie featuring Ozzy and Church's chicken?
After a brief retirement while I got married and traveled the country, I'm back. Just getting back into the swing of things for now, but gearing up to hit things up like I used to.

Offline CaptainPenguin

  • Bastardo!
  • Squirrel Strolenati
  • Emperor
  • *
  • Posts: 5869
  • Awards Questor Hall of Heroes 10
    • Awards
DRAGONIZE! The Secret of True Half-Dragon Power!
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2003, 06:38:41 PM »
Well...I wouldn't know....But if that's true, I'm going to stay far far far away from it....
Currently Reading: "Kafka On The Shore" by Haruki Murakami

Currently Listening To: "Piece Of Time" by Atheist

Offline Chaosmark

  • Harbringer of Segfaults
  • Strolenati
  • Emperor
  • *
  • Posts: 1260
  • Awards Master Questor Item Guild Hall of Heroes 10
    • The Sleepless Hacker
    • Awards
Half Dragons...
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2005, 12:25:42 AM »
Interestingly enough, I actually had (still do in fact) a half-dragon character on an RPing site, and he seems to work quite well, when restricted properly.

   Aside from the purely RPing factor of the character not being able to control said transformation(s), there was/is a massive magical requirement for such, and it makes transformation in all but the most dangerous situations impractical.

   And on a purely me note, I believe he's my best RPed character so far. ^^
P(A|B) = P(B|A)*P(A)/P(B)

By the power of Bayes!

Acolyte Lithil Darkheart – Level 1 Necromancer
STR: 1 | END: 2 | CON: 3 | DEX: 3 | CHA: 3 | INT: 3

Current guild quest: --

Offline MoonHunter

  • Waunderer
  • Emperor
  • ****
  • Posts: 3510
  • Awards Article Guild Systems Guild Society Guild Locations Guild Questor Item Guild
    • Awards
DRAGONIZE! The Secret of True Half-Dragon Power!
« Reply #8 on: June 10, 2005, 08:54:45 AM »
To quote The One: Woah.

You know, I really need to get that as a sound file.

This is a thread from the WAY BACK. Someone did not let an old thread be forgot.... Good thread diving Chaosmark.

Do you guys remember creating and commenting on this one so long ago?


Well besides the genetic improbabilities, because not only is it beyond species lines (where maybe you can get half elves/ orcs because they are all related to each other genetically speaking... this goes beyond phylum lines, it has to be done with magic. The shapeshifting turns the Dragon into a human, without any cool dragon abilities... which are magical... so no cool magical dragon abilities should be transfered. Unless someone does it on purpose.

Now we need to consider, why would a dragon want a half dragon child?

Can't find a Dragon Mate?

Lost a Dragon Mate and can't mate with another (against tradition/ biology)

Needs a tool to do its bidding (or will) and makes one.  (The child, properly manipulated, may hate its parent but do exactly what the parent needed to be done... thinking its their own idea. These things are nearly immortal and very intelligent).

Someone else needs a tool, and the Dragon is making one for them. (see above).

Dragons are dying out and half dragons are better than no dragons at all?
MoonHunter
Sage, Gamer, Mystic, Wit
"The road less traveled is less traveled for a reason."
"The world needs dreamers to give it a soul."
"And it needs realists to keep it alive."
Authentic Strolenite ®©

Offline EchoMirage

  • Caffeinated Alcoholic Blood
  • Strolenati
  • Emperor
  • *
  • Posts: 1718
  • Medice cura te ipsum
  • Awards Lifeforms Guild Item Guild Master Questor NPC Guild Golden Creator Lifeforms Guild Elite
    • Awards
DRAGONIZE! The Secret of True Half-Dragon Power!
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2005, 09:45:13 AM »
Perhaps male dragons are just much more sexually driven than their female counterparts. Also, dragons could be hermaphrodites and cycle through the gender changes at different speeds, so perhaps the dragon pair happened to be the same gender at the same time, so one went for fun elsewhere, or perhaps Laina the Dragoness, 100 years female and suddenly male, could not control the rush of testosterone...

The creation on purpose is a great idea, with much story potential.

Also, an option could be that dragons don't mate amongst each other, they breed with lesser beings, and the scion has to find a way to mature into a true dragon. :babyd:
"Captain, the buttocks are moving from the pink into the red and purple spectrum! We cannot maintain this rate of spanking any longer!"

Authentic Strolenite (though spanked) (C) (R)

Offline Chaosmark

  • Harbringer of Segfaults
  • Strolenati
  • Emperor
  • *
  • Posts: 1260
  • Awards Master Questor Item Guild Hall of Heroes 10
    • The Sleepless Hacker
    • Awards
Whoops...
« Reply #10 on: June 10, 2005, 10:25:20 AM »
*shifty eyes* Hehe, wasn't even paying attention to the last post date on this one...Sorry. I typically try to keep myself from diving into old threads; in this case, I came upon the link in a newer thread, so I didn't think to check dates. Though now that I do a bit of searching to find some info for usage here in a minute, I find Moonhunter tellin' me to find a good ol' topic and post something. ^^ Vindicated at last!

Anywho, the way we did it was that there was originally a race known as the Dra'Mel'Kai, the first dragons that had near infinite power (something like Agar's idea, or another that I cannot quite remember where), and their firstborn children were the Dra'Jeh'Nai, the dragons most of us know (and probably hate when facing one). However, due to some issues, the Dra'Mel'Kai revoked the powers from the Dra'Jeh'Nai, leaving them without the awesome might they had before.

Then the half-dragons came along, known as the Dra'Kai. THey were the result of a Dra'Mel'Kai falling in love with a mortal woman, ect. As for the species crossings, so? He's a being of near infinite power, he's capable of almost anything this side of reality. Anywho, the Dra'Kai were eventually exterminated by the Dra'Jeh'Nai, who were jealous that the powers taken fom them were given, in part, to the Dra'Kai, who then were favored by the Dra'Jeh'Nai. The bloodlines were thinned, and the Dra'Kai faded from the picture, until occassionally bloodlines would merge once more to give someone the power of the half-dragon.

Writing it out like that makes it sound quite a bit like a soap opera, but meh. That's how the story goes, though in it's original form it looks alot like an ancient myth. Mebbe I'll post it sometime...

Coming down to it, I suppose that technically the Dra'Kai (half-dragons) /were/ created on purpose, but I had never thought it out that far. Also, due to the bloodline thinning, ect., it leaves the GM open to give or not give any powers to the player. Great limiting factor.

And Echo, interesting idea. We might have to flesh that out.
P(A|B) = P(B|A)*P(A)/P(B)

By the power of Bayes!

Acolyte Lithil Darkheart – Level 1 Necromancer
STR: 1 | END: 2 | CON: 3 | DEX: 3 | CHA: 3 | INT: 3

Current guild quest: --

Offline MoonHunter

  • Waunderer
  • Emperor
  • ****
  • Posts: 3510
  • Awards Article Guild Systems Guild Society Guild Locations Guild Questor Item Guild
    • Awards
DRAGONIZE! The Secret of True Half-Dragon Power!
« Reply #11 on: June 10, 2005, 10:58:22 AM »
Old threads are here to be ressurected. This is not a conversation forum (except the tavern), it is an information forum. It supports the posts on the front page. Some of them are expanded versions of the front page, some are posts here because there is not a category for them on the front page (like Lifeforms, Races, and Organizations).

Unless it is a plea for "help with my game/ plot for next week", the posts here are merely "information" to be used in any game.  Something I did a year or three ago might be immediately appropriate for you right now. And you have never seen it before. It might be a springboard for your own new activity. And the fun part is, your new post might take the idea in new directions that we didn't see a year or three ago. So Never worry about ressurecting an old thread. In fact, GO DO IT (yes, Life is a Nike Commerical).
MoonHunter
Sage, Gamer, Mystic, Wit
"The road less traveled is less traveled for a reason."
"The world needs dreamers to give it a soul."
"And it needs realists to keep it alive."
Authentic Strolenite ®©

Offline Dragonlordmax

  • Strolenati
  • Knight
  • *
  • Posts: 266
  • Awards Guardian of the Citadel Hall of Heroes 10
    • Awards
Making it Possible
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2005, 04:37:09 PM »
As for the biological impossibility of a half-dragon, here is my answer:
Note: For my purposes, X and Y are, as usual, male and female genes, h is human, d is dragon, and n is situation specific.

Shape-shifted creatures have two sets of genes, their original, which is stored away, and their current forms, which are used. Any of these genes could be passed on to the child. For example, a male dragon shapeshifts into a human male and has a child.
                           
                          ----Xd----Yd----Xh----Yh
                 
                Xh      XXdh    XYdh      XXhh     XYhh

                Xh      XXdh    XYdh      XXhh     XYhh
                 
Thus, a 50% chance of a half-dragon, whether male or female child.

However, there can be problems when trans-gender shifts are made. This time, the male dragon became a human female.

                          ----Xd----Yd----Xh----Xh

                Xh      XXdh     XYdh      XXhh    XXhh

                Yh      XYdh     YYdh      XYhh     XYhh

The problem is the YY child, and as the GM probably doesn't want to create a new gender, I'd call this a miscarriage. Thus, in this situation, a human child is most likely, and 2/3 of the half-dragons will be female.

As a final example, when both parents shapeshift, so, I'll use n as ogre, which both the dragon male and human female have shifted into. We'll assume no trans-gender shifts.

                          ----Yd----Xd----Yn----Xn

                Xh     XYhd    XXdh     XYhn     XXhn

                Xh     XYhd    XXdh     XYhn     XXhn

                Xn     XYdn    XXdn     XYnn     XXnn

                Xn     XYdn    XXdn     XYnn     XXnn

Thus:
     Males: 25% half-human/half-dragon; 25% half-human/half-ogre; and
               25% half-dragon/half-ogre; 25% full-ogre
     Females: Same percentages

On a final note, I don't think that a half-dragon would look anything like a human OR a dragon, and, in fact, would probably look like a giant, scaly monkey.
He who says little speaks two syllables.
-God of Thunder

Offline EchoMirage

  • Caffeinated Alcoholic Blood
  • Strolenati
  • Emperor
  • *
  • Posts: 1718
  • Medice cura te ipsum
  • Awards Lifeforms Guild Item Guild Master Questor NPC Guild Golden Creator Lifeforms Guild Elite
    • Awards
DRAGONIZE! The Secret of True Half-Dragon Power!
« Reply #13 on: July 15, 2005, 04:47:59 PM »
Hey, slow with the math!

What we have to consider is that a human has 23 pairs of chromosomes - all of them code for him being human, and the last pair, the gonosomes (as opposed to the rest, the autosomes), code for gender, amongst other things.

Now, all of a human's chromosomes are likely to be human.

If a dragon had the same number of chromosomes, then a half-dragon childe would have one fully human set and one draconic set.

This may have the following consequences:

If the human set is dominant and the dragon set recessive, then the human set is expressed, the child human, but with the potential to sire/give birth to a very weird child when mating with another such crossbreed. Thus, the first generation is inapparent.

If the sets are co-dominant, or intermediarily dominant, either the attributes of both species are fully expressed (a were-dragon?), or in the case of intermediary gene expression, a half-breed with attributes half way between the human and dragon heritage comes into being.

Likewise, if the dragon set is dominant, then the human genes remain dormant until at least in one chromosome pair, two human chromosomes meet.

Furthermore, parts of the genome can be dominant, while other parts might be recessive. Thus, a crossbreed might always express certain attributes of the dragon parent, say, if the gene set for 'wings' is dominant, then the offspring, whether having one or two of the dragon chromosomes in this locus will have wings. If two heterozygotes (bearing only one wing-gene) mate, they might spawn a child that does not bear wings (25% of the time) as it has inherited two 'no wing' human genes.

The matter is even more complicated in the second generation:
Due to the so-called crossing-over phenomenon, dragon and human chromosomes can exchange segments, thus producing mixed chromosomes with parts of the DNA of both parents.

Now, a spermatozoon, or ovum, has only one set of chromosomes. In the meiosis step when they come into being, they are allocated one of the two chromosomes. Thus, the reproductory cell of a half-dragon parent may get anywhere from 0 to 23 dragon chromosomes. He could spawn a purebreed human with a human mate, a half-dragon with the same, a pureblood dragon with a dragon (or another halfbreed!) or simply anything in between.

Wow.

Now, this brief treatise on genetics is sure difficult to stomach, or implement in a game, and fantasy uses to stretch realism.

My suggestion is the following  :idea:

 :arrow:  Dragons, the beasts that are an embodiment of magic, should be dependent on chromosomes?
Why?
What if their 'cells' or simply 'seed' housed magical patterns, small vortices or sigils, runes of power in microscopic form, that, through a symphony of concordant magic, allow the existance of a being that denies the laws of physics and sometimes even the will of deities.

A dragon, when shapeshifted, still carries the same patterns, they just adjusted to give him another form (so this is no shapeshiftinjg spell, but an ability that must be learnt). When he mates with, say, a human, those small charges find an ovum, and enter, nudging it to life. A half-dragon kid would have a single set of human chromosomes and one of those tiny runes.
The human set would give him the human guise, while the draconic would shine through, and manifest in things like growing wings... a slow metamorphosis. One that can be hastened throughj training, aided by talent and strong will, or learnt through meticulous study.

If such a half-breed mates, he can pass on few or many of the magic chromosomes to his kids.
Thus, they either will have the ability to train a power, or not.

A child of a dragon and a half-breed, or of two halfbreeds, will have a wide array of possibilities of the layout of his pattern. He might have dragon chromosome pairs in a few loci, while the other pairs might be totally human - thus being truly draconic in a few attributes, and lacking dragon power in others totally. He might have a mixed set in say 3/4ths of the chromosome pairs, and pure dragon heritage in the rest, making him more draconic in certain areas than a first generation half-breed.
One whose blood is sufficiently thinned might have one or two charges, thus giving him the potential to learn a few draconic abilities, with the rest forever out of his reach.

So:
Let us determine 23 dragon abilities, and assign each to a chromosome.
A character (half-breed) can either be assigned, or 'purchase' dragon chromosome points, and allocate them.

So, one player might spread 23 points out evenly, creating a first generation half-breed, with potential in all areas.
His abilities will surface over time and with training or need, and be variably developed.

Another might omit certain abilities totally, and spend the points to buy fully draconic chromosome pairs, thus giving him full power from the start in certain areas, while closing his path in others. Such a being might have the strength and fire of the dragon, bnut lack his wings, and magical prowess.

 :roll: now, another thing I'd add is the Awareness factor: ranging from say 1 to 6, it determines how well the ability is surfaced. 1 stands for potential that is totally unused, thus the being would be totally human in this regard, but with the door to improvement open, while the rating of 4 stands for full dragon power, and 6 for maximum dragon prowess in the given field.

One PC might be strong, armored in scales and have terrible claws, with great prowess in all those fields, while another might have only inherited the dragon's magic talent, well-fledged from early childhood on, and NO visible dragon traits.

 :roll: Another thought: One who truly masters an aspect of the dragon nature might be abel to achieve Ascension in that field: convert his human chromosome of the pair to draconic, from matter to energy. It might even be possible to convert a chromosome of a completely human pair, though extremely difficult.

Dragons might be dependant on mating with other species, who in turn have to mature into a dragon.
Some cults might consider them a disease, or curse. Some might think them spawn of the devil planted ionto the loins of innocent females.
Some might think them gods.

And they themselves? Rivality, seeking of the self, madness for power, despair at the unwanted change...
The possibilities are innumerable.
"Captain, the buttocks are moving from the pink into the red and purple spectrum! We cannot maintain this rate of spanking any longer!"

Authentic Strolenite (though spanked) (C) (R)